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Capitalism is dying...

By Heraclitusstudent following x   2018 Jul 13, 10:32am 3,025 views   75 comments   watch   sfw   quote     share    


Capitalism creates such a level of efficiency as to make a large part of humanity useless.
Half the US population couldn't come up with $400 to face an emergency.

The incentive of capitalism are clear: workers are a cost to be eliminated. And companies have become extremely good at this game. Unfortunately, having customers is also a requirement for capitalism. And customers normally get their cash from wages. This means the system is not stable. It's gravitating more and more around the top 10% of the population. The goals that we are optimizing against are simply not good for society and humanity. The goal can't be a winner take all system. You need to invest in people.

So you see the hollowing of the economy, you see the shrinking opportunities and social mobility, the rise of economic frailties and poverty, the rise of debts to compensate the dearth of incomes. All these are not the results of social programs, or socialism. Instead they are the natural results of capitalism gone wild at a global level.

And it won't stop there:

https://www.zdnet.com/article/global-sales-of-industrial-robots-log-staggering-rise/
"New data confirms anecdotal reports of the blistering hot global automation industry."
"The biggest growth came from China, where sales rose 58 percent."

Ironically the only way capitalism could endure is precisely through more social programs, and a better safety net.
A heavy dose of socialism is the only way to entrench capitalism. Without that, capitalism as a whole is probably doomed.
Suck it up right wingers.

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36   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 13, 4:37pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says
Reality says
Capitalistic free market place is about giving every individual the right to choose, by using his/her own money.

That worked when most people could play a useful role in a society. This doesn't work when poor people have no useful skills to offer, don't have land to produce food, don't have land to build a shelter, and basically are left out with time stamps, and pooping between cars on the street.


I'm sure you have some household chore that you'd like someone else to do for you if the price is low enough, and how much skill is required for something as simple as mowing your lawn? There is no such thing as "no useful skills to offer" if the price is low enough. What's preventing low-skill people from becoming employed are two factors: minimum-wage laws banning them from working pays that their low productivity can warrant, and welfare rules removing incentive to work. Both the non-working population (unless supported by family or private charity) and over-priced bureaucrats distributing welfare are results by taxes and government-bonds.
37   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 13, 4:42pm   ↑ like (2)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Quigley says
there is always a place for human effort, and automation won’t eliminate that anytime soon. If it did, perhaps more things could be socialized to the point where nobody would need to work to provide basic necessities. But, those who DID choose to work would be rewarded with the first pick of every luxury and status symbol. I’d guess that’s our end point.


Exactly! Even the poorest recipients on welfare today usually have color TVs, internet, cellphones and in many cases personal automobiles that can take them hundreds of miles away from home in a day, all of which were unheard of for Kings and Queens as recently as Queen Victoria.
38   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 13, 4:53pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says
Reality says
Society is of course Darwinian. Evolution is always taking place for not only the genetic human organism but also human ideas ("memic evolution").

Evolution of human ideas has nothing to do with Darwinian evolution. Poor people now reproduce at a much faster rate than rich people.
Thus society is by definition not Darwinian evolution.


Of course it is still Darwinian evolution. Neanderthals had bigger brain and were probably more intelligent than our ancestors; however our ancestors had better trade networks to bring in sharper weapons, and even food in times of famine. Hypatia (the first female president on record of the world's largest university, in late Roman Empire) was most certainly more educated than the early Christian mobs that killed her, but the replacement of demographically collapsing Romans (whose women refused to reproduce thanks to an earlier version of feminism) by early Christians and invading "barbarians" was very much a Darwinian event: the religions and social ideas of early Christians and "barbarians" were simply far more successful at reproducing than those of the late Romans.




And when upheaval happens, more poor people may die but not in the same proportion as rich people. The French or Russian revolution decimated the aristocracy. To say that Robespierre or Lenin were not poor is missing the point. Of course they were smart enough to elevate themselves, but they were not aristocrats, nor rich.


Robespierre was a law student at the world's largest university (Paris) and was a student representative (if not president of the student body) welcoming Louise XVI when the King visited the university a few years before the French Revolution. Massive revolutions are usually the result of cadet/apprentice bureaucrats (i.e. "students") unwilling to wait for their turn to run the bureaucratic monopoly, so they have to come up with a scheme to kill off the incumbent bureaucrats. In Darwinian terms, it's the prosperity having multiplied too many organisms in the environmental niche for bureaucrats (the younger cadet/apprentice bureaucrats realize their paths to advancement are blocked by incumbents), so a brutal round of mutual kill-off have to take place among those with bureaucratic aspirations.
39   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 13, 4:57pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says
Reality says
Every episode of capitalism in human history (e.g. Ancient Rome, Ancient Greece, Hrappans) eventually died because the children growing up under prosperity went to school and learned socialism/communism (e.g. Plato) and tried to become "social engineers" and worshipers of authority (as students being appraised by professors) instead of staying in the habit of a free market place and appreciate the difference between individuals and the invisible hand that bring forth both prosperity and innovation.


Ok, let's not try to engineer anything. Let us let capitalism die and collapse from its own weight in the process I described.
Like I care.


If / when you get caught up in that process, chances are very high that you will die in that baptism of fire. The population of Ancient Rome collapsed by 90% in a few decades. Hrappa (a metropolis with municipal-wide indoor plumbing, the likes of which wasn't seen in the modern world until nearly 20th century) was wiped off the map and erased from human memory for over 3000 years until re-discovery in the 20th century.
40   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 13, 5:18pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Reality says
If / when you get caught up in that process, chances are very high that you will die in that baptism of fire. The population of Ancient Rome collapsed by 90% in a few decades.


So either we let capitalism die by itself and civilization collapses, or we manage it and socialism destroys civilization.
Sounds like we're fucked either way.

Don't worry, the power-that-be will put everyone on welfare, and keep for themselves the opulent fruits technocracy.
But of course Reality will still be preaching capitalism long after capitalists around the world have fled it and it has ceased to exist.
41   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 13, 5:30pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says
Reality says
If / when you get caught up in that process, chances are very high that you will die in that baptism of fire. The population of Ancient Rome collapsed by 90% in a few decades.


So either we let capitalism die by itself and civilization collapses, or we manage it and socialism destroys civilization.
Sounds like we're fucked either way.


Being alive is the leading cause of death; the correlation is 100%! In fact, every single one of us will die. However, its inevitability is not a reason to accelerate the arrival of death. Likewise, the prosperity and relative freedom/liberty that we enjoy will eventually come to an end, but that eventuality is not a reason why we want a relatively free market place to end sooner.




Don't worry, the power-that-be will put everyone on welfare, and keep for themselves the opulent fruits technocracy.



Welfare is fundamentally little different from plantation slavery: free housing, free medicine, free education, and even free food+clothing! all at the discretion of the slave owner.


But of course Reality will still be preaching capitalism long after capitalists around the world have fled it and it has ceased to exist.


My hope is that the relatively free capitalistic market place will out-live my own individual biological life. Death is inevitable to any organism / system, but it's not a good reason for welcoming its early arrival. Socialism/Communism is in fact a death-cult: the idea that "from each his ability and to each his want" is indeed achieved in death! In death, each person's ability is "nothing," and each person's want is also "nothing." The promise was "real" (in the Faustian Bargain sense) but the followers of Marxism don't seem to understand what was being promised.
42   FortWayne   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 13, 5:35pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Under Trump capitalism is roaring back!!!
43   CBOEtrader   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 4:24am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says

So either we let capitalism die by itself and civilization collapses, or we manage it and socialism destroys civilization.
Sounds like we're fucked either way.


Jordan Peterson talks about the 85 IQ lower limit for US army employment. Something like 12% to 15% of the population is lower than that, and therefore not intelligent enough to wash trucks.
44   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Jul 14, 5:21am   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Hassan_Rouhani says
jazz_music says
Capitalism can go on thriving right? Why not? What would stop it from becoming more powerful?



Don't do crime - serve no time. Easy-peasy.


When Everything’s a Crime, Everyone’s a Criminal
45   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Jul 14, 5:46am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

FortWayne says
Under Trump capitalism is roaring back!!!


Really? Where do you see Free Market Capitalism roaring back?

I look around the System of the USA, and I struggle to find any remnants of Free Market Capitalism. The last part of the economy that resembles a Free Market for Capitalists is the Cannabis marketplace, but even that is being invaded by the Regulators
46   MisterLefty   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 14, 5:54am   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says
That worked when most people could play a useful role in a society
Something wrong with picking fruit?
47   FortWayne   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 6:35am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Perhaps you are blind to it.

I see businesses everywhere producing and engaging in commerce. My only complaint is CA fee for business. That’s truly anti economy.

Aphroman says
FortWayne says
Under Trump capitalism is roaring back!!!


Really? Where do you see Free Market Capitalism roaring back?

I look around the System of the USA, and I struggle to find any remnants of Free Market Capitalism. The last part of the economy that resembles a Free Market for Capitalists is the Cannabis marketplace, but even that is being invaded by the Regulators
48   APHAman   ignore (8)   2018 Jul 14, 6:53am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

FortWayne says
Perhaps you are blind to it.

I see businesses everywhere producing and engaging in commerce. My only complaint is CA fee for business. That’s truly anti economy.

Aphroman says
FortWayne says
Under Trump capitalism is roaring back!!!


Really? Where do you see Free Market Capitalism roaring back?

I look around the System of the USA, and I struggle to find any remnants of Free Market Capitalism. The last part of the economy that resembles a Free Market for Capitalists is the Cannabis marketplace, but even that is being invaded by the Regulators


You said under Trump Capitalism is roaring back!!

Where do you see this?

I see a President and hos followers meddling in all types of different markets. Massive Government intervention. The opposite of Free Market Capitalism
49   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 14, 11:32am   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

The army's IQ=85 requirement is mainly due to impulse control / safety of officer consideration and the fact in a pinch even the cooks and car pool have to take weapons and fight under tactical command.

In civilian life, IQ as low as the 60's can find simple jobs such as line cooks. In fact, because people with an IQ that low are certifiably retarded/disabled, the employers are exempt from minimum wage laws when hiring them . . . so it ends up being easier for a person like that to find jobs in the private sector. This phenomenon really proves that "unemployable" in most cases is actually the result of minimum wage laws / welfare rules. Of course, the life-time productivity vs. consumption by a person with IQ in the 60's is likely negative. That's why it is not legal for a normal person to have sex with a person with IQ that low and risk reproducing another generation of retarded.
50   jazz_music   ignore (6)   2018 Jul 14, 12:31pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Aphroman says
When Everything’s a Crime, Everyone’s a Criminal

Truth. What are your local ordinances? How would you know if you violated one of them? Who will give you a list of them? What about the county? How can you find out whther you are going to violate a county ordinance?
51   TrumpingTits   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 14, 12:35pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says
So you see the hollowing of the economy, you see the shrinking opportunities and social mobility, the rise of economic frailties and poverty, the rise of debts to compensate the dearth of incomes


All of which has the root causes of creaping socialism and kleptocratic statism, not capitalism.
52   CBOEtrader   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 12:37pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Reality says
In fact, because people with an IQ that low are certifiably retarded/disabled, the employers are exempt from minimum wage laws when hiring them


Wait. How much does it cost to hire a retard army?
53   CBOEtrader   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 12:40pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Reality says
This phenomenon really proves that "unemployable" in most cases is actually the result of minimum wage laws / welfare rules.


Do you genuinely feel that post AI there will be enough employment for zero skill laborers? Pretty sure drivers of every kind, dishwashers, veggie choppers, busboys, lawn mowers, pizza delivery drivers, and especially fast food workers... are all being looked at for robot replacement.
54   jazz_music   ignore (6)   2018 Jul 14, 12:41pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MisterLefty says
Something wrong with picking fruit?

During the last depression people fell back on jobs like that, but farming is highly automated now and run by big corporations. They don't want or need you to come and work their farms, they got high tech equipment for that.

Family run farms are in serious trouble against big corporations. The stress they are dealing with is unbearable. Their suicide rate is higher than any other occupation. You think they want some people to come pick fruit for them? In the south they have tried using prisoners but they found out that the illegals are the best workers.
https://www.theblaze.com/news/2018/06/26/cdc-farmers-are-committing-suicide-at-5-times-the-rate-of-the-rest-of-the-population
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/19/nyregion/farmer-suicides-mark-tough-times-for-new-york-dairy-industry.html
55   Patrick   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 14, 1:07pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Aphroman says
even that is being invaded by the Regulators


Regulations have two functions:

1. to prevent competition by making it harder for small/upcoming companies to comply
2. to protect the public

#2 is used and as excuse for #1 in normal everyday politics. I learned this from a book by John Kenneth Galbraith, but can't remember which one. Some other good insights:

https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/John_Kenneth_Galbraith

jazz_music says
farming is highly automated now and run by big corporations. They don't want or need you to come and work their farms, they got high tech equipment for that


They do need people who understand the equipment, but that knowledge is difficult to get and does require a few more IQ points than average.

In general, there are plenty of good jobs all the time, it's just that those jobs require those IQ points and some years of dedicated study. As tech gets better, the prospects for those who cannot or will not dedicate themselves to learning keep getting worse. But the prospects for those who can learn tech deeply keep getting better.
56   jazz_music   ignore (6)   2018 Jul 14, 1:10pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
They do need people who understand the equipment

The point is that the successful farms are enormous, backed by billionaires and require very few people to run them.
57   Patrick   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 14, 1:23pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

But farming is actually just a small part of the economy these days.

Tech requires a lot more people than are well-trained and available so far, and the demand is likely to keep growing.
58   Quigley   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 14, 1:28pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Is it dead yet?
59   jazz_music   ignore (6)   2018 Jul 14, 1:45pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
the demand is likely to keep growing.

Ergo the outcry for issuing work visas, the HR training to offer jobs in a way that they cannot be filled with citizenry, the lobbying to increase the type of visas offered and increased offshoring of jobs.

Even in the clothing industry, China and India are developing subcontractor factories in Ethiopia and all over east Africa where the employees are so uneducated that they have to be trained in basic hygiene and conduct in a workplace.

My point is that this is another area that shows a great need for the forces of capitalism to be managed by prudent government to provide the broader prosperity that the people bargained for when they allowed these privileged corporate entities to come to exist in the first place.

Like enforcement, corporate entities will not self-manage. So don't expect either to ever happen. There will be a lot of screaming as soon as government has any effect at all on either of these sectors.

Let the screaming begin, its long overdue, it will be a healthy sign.
60   CBOEtrader   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 1:54pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
But the prospects for those who can learn tech deeply keep getting better.


To be a good programmer you need a minimum 115 IQ (just my observation). The best programmers are perhaps the most brilliant people you'd ever meet.

Where in that world does the 30% of population below 90 IQ find an opportunity?
61   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 2:29pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

MisterLefty says
Something wrong with picking fruit?


Are you suggesting the 95 millions people not in labor force pick fruits?
Fruits are being picked right now with the labor force we have, correct?

I don't think people here are really trying to understand the problem.
62   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 2:32pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Patrick says
In general, there are plenty of good jobs all the time, it's just that those jobs require those IQ points and some years of dedicated study. As tech gets better, the prospects for those who cannot or will not dedicate themselves to learning keep getting worse. But the prospects for those who can learn tech deeply keep getting better.


If everyone had an IQ of 120, jobs in tech would require an IQ of 150.
As it stands, there are already tons of useless or overly speculative things done in tech.
63   Heraclitusstudent   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 14, 2:35pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Reality says
This phenomenon really proves that "unemployable" in most cases is actually the result of minimum wage laws / welfare rules.

If it wasn't for minimum wages laws, wages would fall to $2/h. As a result the end demand would collapse further, and even more debt would be required. Why do you never consider the effect of low wages on spending when half the population already can't come up with 400 fucking dollars?
64   Ceffer   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 14, 2:35pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Unbridled immigration will solve this problem.
65   Patrick   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 14, 2:44pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CBOEtrader says
Where in that world does the 30% of population below 90 IQ find an opportunity?


One hope is that the genetic and environmental determinants of intelligence will become well understood, and people will choose to have genes and upbringing that cause high intelligence.

Or maybe that won't happen. I don't know.
66   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 14, 3:33pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CBOEtrader says
In fact, because people with an IQ that low are certifiably retarded/disabled, the employers are exempt from minimum wage laws when hiring them


Wait. How much does it cost to hire a retard army?


LOL! Apparently, the officers don't like the idea of too many sub-85 IQ semi-retards and sub-65 IQ full retards armed, and potentially easily triggered.
67   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 14, 3:40pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CBOEtrader says
Do you genuinely feel that post AI there will be enough employment for zero skill laborers? Pretty sure drivers of every kind, dishwashers, veggie choppers, busboys, lawn mowers, pizza delivery drivers, and especially fast food workers... are all being looked at for robot replacement.


When automobiles replaced horse buggies as cabs, people feared that the job of cab drivers was finished because it would take far fewer cabs to deliver the same passenger-miles in a city. What really happened was the exact opposite: far more cab drivers, so many of them that the city had to come up schemes to limit the number of cabs clogging traffic, because automobile cabs became cheaper and more passengers want cab rides; passenger-miles count exploded and the city's commerce taking off creating even more jobs as transportation cost plummeted.

Something similar is bound to happen, as AI-based automation reduces the price of goods and services. More people will buy up more goods and services as their prices come down . . . if the particular good/service doesn't warrant the capital investment of building robots for it, people will be hired to do it (if cheap enough, and because cost of living comes down due to automation, in the absence of minimum wage laws, more people will be able to have their first jobs instead of the current ever shrinking labor participation rate)
68   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 14, 3:49pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CBOEtrader says
To be a good programmer you need a minimum 115 IQ (just my observation). The best programmers are perhaps the most brilliant people you'd ever meet.

Where in that world does the 30% of population below 90 IQ find an opportunity?


People who buy into the faddish scams like AGW usually have sub-120 IQ.

The 30% sub-90 IQ population can work all sorts of jobs not yet replaced by automation. Automation is not going to replace all automatable jobs all at once. Every single job on the Tesla production line today can potentially be automated NOW! but it hasn't been. Human labor happens to have the advantage of being flexible, and laws making that inflexible would only produce unemployment.
69   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 14, 4:02pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Heraclitusstudent says
Reality says
This phenomenon really proves that "unemployable" in most cases is actually the result of minimum wage laws / welfare rules.

If it wasn't for minimum wages laws, wages would fall to $2/h. As a result the end demand would collapse further, and even more debt would be required. Why do you never consider the effect of low wages on spending when half the population already can't come up with 400 fucking dollars?


$2/hr would still be a lot higher than the $5/day that Henry Ford offered (and even his was more than doubling then prevailing wage).

Why half the population can't come up with $400? They have been sucked dry by debt service, either directly or indirectly through the rent, utilities, medical and educational bills that they pay (all of which have massive components paying towards the service providers' debt service).

More debt "is required" to keep the bankster blood suckers alive! That's why $5/day was considered very very high wage at the time of Henry Ford, but $16/day ($2/hr) is unbearably low today. The massive inflation has been used to keep bad debts alive and allow banksters keep sucking blood out of the real economy. The real people can live fine on $5/day if the dollar's purchasing power is such that a brand new car cost only $250 (like Model T at that time), 50-days labor of the worker buying a brand new car. In fact, since an average new car today cost $40k, that's equivalent to $40,000 / 50 = $800/day now! $200k a year! for a line worker. No union due to pay either. That's what your beloved blood-sucking institutions have done over a century of inflationary blood sucking: reducing the worker from $800/day to less than $100/day, while praising silly political pretend-work like the minimum wage law that keep workers out of starter jobs. Letting the bad debts die (i.e. letting the creditors eat their own credit risk) would have served the society much better.

BTW, it is not minimum wage laws that keep wage above $2/hr today. 96+% of hourly wage earners are paid more than minimum wage, and that's before counting salaried workers and self-employed. It is productivity (not minimum wage) that keep workers' pay up. In fact, if not for minimum wage laws, small businesses like fast food would be able to both hire more entry level workers and pay higher wages for their more experienced workers, instead of the current trend towards losing all experienced workers (due to wage flattening) because the owners have to pay raised minimum wage workers; the current trend is of course leading to replacing overpaid (compared to their low productivity) minimum-wage workers with automation so the money ends up going to technology companies instead of the original experienced fast food workers, exacerbating income inequality. Minimum wage law is actually reducing real end demand: by keeping workers of lower productivity out of work and reducing the purchasing power of those who do work.
70   PrivilegedtobeWhite   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 14, 4:26pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

CBOEtrader says
Jordan Peterson talks about the 85 IQ lower limit for US army employment. Something like 12% to 15% of the population is lower than that, and therefore not intelligent enough to wash trucks.
So do we prop up that 12-15% and let them create more retards, or do we let them die off as nature intended?
71   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 14, 4:46pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

PrivilegedtobeWhite says
CBOEtrader says
Jordan Peterson talks about the 85 IQ lower limit for US army employment. Something like 12% to 15% of the population is lower than that, and therefore not intelligent enough to wash trucks.
So do we prop up that 12-15% and let them create more retards, or do we let them die off as nature intended?


A relatively free market place already provides a clean and humane solution: letting the less productive find work that can keep themselves alive, but at the same time the low earnings making them sexually unattractive so that they are not advantaged in reproduction. The combination of minimum wage laws and welfare on the other hand produces a monster of forcing them stay home and find nothing to do except for having sex and reproducing more offspring of questionable productivity in the next generation, trapping themselves into generational poverty.
72   PeopleUnited   ignore (2)   2018 Jul 15, 6:20am   ↑ like (3)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Quigley says
You can think of it as working for the elites, or you can take a wider more expansive view, you can consider the progress that the amalgamation of human work and ingenuity has produced, the cities, the infrastructure, the amenities, the entertainment, the easy access to necessities and also luxuries, the medicine that gives us long lifespans, and the ever escalating technological progress that keeps moving the bar forward. You can consider the absolutely INCREDIBLE advances humanity as a WHOLE has experienced, how an average worker in middle class America has more choices for luxury and medicine than Louis XIV, and you can conclude that human work has moved HUMANITY forward! Sure, the elites maintain an edge over the average man, and they still call the shots for the most part. But the improvements our combined work has wrought upon the land are enjoyed by all of us!

You’re not working for the boss, in furtherance of his bottom line. You’re working for the human race, in ...


I don't mind working for someone else. What bothers me is that the vast majority of people do not earn enough to pay for a home of their own. The average worker should be able to earn enough from his labor to literally own his own home (home loan paid off completely) after 15 years of work. That cannot be allowed by the elites because then there is less motivation to continue working for them. It is the corrupt banking system that makes us all slaves.

It is great that the collective labor of our ancestors has afforded us such luxury and medicine not available to previous generations. It is awful that it now takes two incomes to produce the same standard of living that a family with one working person could afford 30-40 years ago.
73   everything   ignore (1)   2018 Jul 16, 4:30pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

Lol, capitalism is socialism - for the rich, corporations, the bankers, politicians, the elite, the corrupt, etc.
74   Patrick   ignore (0)   2018 Jul 16, 5:39pm   ↑ like (1)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

PeopleUnited says
What bothers me is that the vast majority of people do not earn enough to pay for a home of their own. The average worker should be able to earn enough from his labor to literally own his own home (home loan paid off completely) after 15 years of work. That cannot be allowed by the elites because then there is less motivation to continue working for them. It is the corrupt banking system that makes us all slaves.



Yes, our owners need obedient servants and so they lobby and twist the laws and the bailouts to make sure that houses remain too expensive for most.

But they are greatly helped by the self-interest of everyone who already bought. All those owners (mostly debtors) viciously oppose any effort to make houses cheap.

So it's a conspiracy of the public against itself in a way.
75   Reality   ignore (5)   2018 Jul 16, 8:05pm   ↑ like (0)   ↓ dislike (0)   quote   flag        

US median home price mid-2017 was only around $200k. That translated to $800/mo on 30yr mortgage at then prevailing interest rate, about $1200/mo on 15-yr mortgage. That's well within the affordability of two adults making median income; in fact, within reach of one-income for adult male median.

The real question is, why do so many people want to live in where housing is expensive? The progressive income tax system makes it quite obvious that it doesn't pay to chase high income jobs in high living-cost locations unless one is willing to do long commute or rent cheaply.

My answer is: women's hypergamy. Young women want to move to high cost-of-living locations in order to find high-income men who can make it there. Men follow them there in order to get laid. If we look at the population ratio, the major expensive cities are severely imbalanced in gender ratio (far more women than men in NYC, for example), and imbalanced the other way in podunks. Turns out, this perceived inequality is nothing more than the continuation of human evolution via sexual selection. It's just like peacocks have to carry the high cost of a heavy tail in order to get laid, because peahens like to see the extravagant display of fitness (and of course, women likewise have to carry those back-breaking mellons catering to men's visual interest, not functional value).

Housing cost in high-demand area during high-demand time of course is high. Otherwise, we'd have to have run-away construction/bust cycles laying off enormous numbers of construction workers instead of price cycles (busting unwary speculators) in order to hold price steady.

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The Housing Trap
You're being set up to spend your life paying off a debt you don't need to take on, for a house that costs far more than it should. The conspirators are all around you, smiling to lure you in, carefully choosing their words and watching your reactions as they push your buttons, anxiously waiting for the moment when you sign the papers that will trap you and guarantee their payoff. Don't be just another victim of the housing market. Use this book to defend your freedom and defeat their schemes. You can win the game, but first you have to learn how to play it.
115 pages, $12.50

Kindle version available


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